Shipping poll

[salinea]

[Poll #1266990]

Also, what exactly would you put behind "unhealthy"? Is there some kinds of unhealthy which you are willing to ship and others which you draw the lines at (which ones, and why)? Don't hesitate to give some examples!

ETA: this is mostly due to the fact that some of the comments on this post by meganbmoore made me wonder if I was the only one.

Comments

[purple-chalk.livejournal.com]

(Just accidentally voted with an RP journal, if you're wondering why Teddy Lupin has ships, sorry...)

[cygna-hime.livejournal.com]

Since the surefire way to my 'shipper's heart is through best-friend-forever pairings, I mostly 'ship "healthy" pairings (=makes them both happy, has a pretty much equal dynamic, and I can see living happily ever after just because they've been living happily ever up to now), but I think a predilection for "healthy" pairings is more a result of that preference than a cause of it.

Also, while I certainly write stories in which couples don't get a happy ending, I *want*, deep down, to make characters happy, so my serious 'ships tend toward the healthy (=making happy in a way that doesn't squick me).

It's a personal preference; it doesn't bother me in the least that other people 'ship heavy-messed-up pairings, as long as they don't do that horrible badfic thing where they *insist* that this relationship has no flaws and is *perfect*. Because that's creepy.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

I'm sure Teddy Lupin has ships!! I wonder who he ships, though XD

[tiamatschild.livejournal.com]

I have absolutely no problem with people shipping unhealthy pairings (and have quite a few myself!), but it does kind of squick me when people view the dysfunctionality as romantic. Or... gloss over it, try to make it into something generically happy. It makes me uncomfortable.

[redcandle17.livejournal.com]

I've been meaning to make a post about this topic myself. Lately I've seen people at my favorite romance author's message board saying how unhealthy some recent pairings are, which puzzles me because they're supposed to be the hardcore, long-time fans and they should have realized that her couples tended to be "unhealthy" from the start of the series. I like pairings that are inappropriate in various ways. "Healthy" couples tend to be rather boring*.

*In real life as well as fiction, I've found. I know too many people who cheat on or leave their "healthy" partners for more questionable ones.

[cygna-hime.livejournal.com]

I also want to note that it's not that I don't *understand* why people 'ship unhealthy 'ships, any more than I don't understand why people like chocolate ice cream better than vanilla. I just don't myself.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

as long as they don't do that horrible badfic thing where they *insist* that this relationship has no flaws and is *perfect*. Because that's creepy.
Oh, God, yes! I'm with you there. I'll read any kind of darkfic with screwed up relationship dynamics as long as the writer doesn't appear to think they're, like, so cute together and so made to be together. This is one of the thing I frequently didn't like in Snarry fics.

[purple-chalk.livejournal.com]

Aragorn/Legolas, and Fry/Leela.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

I'm with you there, functionality as romantic is very bothering, even though I tend to adore the most wrong, antagonistic and melodramatic pairing myself.

[tiamatschild.livejournal.com]

Oh! And how I define unhealthy is pretty broad - for example, Beachcomber and Perceptor are one of my Transformers otps but... I'm really not sure they're actually good for each other, and writing the way they relate to each other sometimes makes me feel a little sick. It doesn't seem to distress anyone else, though.

Justin and Grant from Cyteen are another example: I mean, they're canon, and kind of inescapable, and I simultaneously get a wee bit gooey about them and go DAMMIT. INVEST EMOTIONALLY IN OTHER PEOPLE because being that insular is not good, and even if they're genetically related, it's clearly incest and just... just really not good for them. But I really enjoy the relationship, anyway.

And then there's Katori/Kaumi/Fuuma which is an incestuous, obsessive, murderous mess (and also, fluffy and adorable what the hell?) but I like it. And I wrote it a lot back when I was writing X.

I haven't really found a line where something's too unhealthy to ship, although there are dynamics that I'm just not interested in, and there are things that... I don't read much fic in, because the ones I read squicked me by being all Oh Everything Here Is Fine and that freaks me.

[puella-nerdii.livejournal.com]

Pff, I write Kara/Leoben and Sei/Sub. What are these "healthy relationships" of which you speak?

To elaborate: I (not-so-)jokingly refer to myself as "wrongsexual," and as a general rule of thumb, the more twisted a particular pairing is, the more I find it appealing. See, the big thread running through almost everything I write is perversion -- not necessarily sexual, but I love taking the normal and making it, well, ab-. Unhealthy relationships, I think, are ones where characters are unable or unwilling to articulate their desires and solve their differences, and that's the stuff of which conflict is made. And I can't write fic without conflict.

The only unhealthy relationships I don't like are ones that are not textually acknowledged as such and are instead presented as Twoo Wub or something equally nauseating. This is my problem with the Twilight series, in a nutshell. (Well, my main problem.) Codependent behavior and stalking and warped/imbalanced power dynamics? There's a lot of potential for dark and sexy fun there, but not when it's presented as the ideal model of a loving relationship and any creepiness is handwaved away on the grounds that "they loooooooove each other." Maybe, but love in and of itself isn't enough to make a relationship work. Plus, love =/= codependency. This is also why I can't read a lot of romances -- or a lot of older ones, at least. And why I give lots of yaoi manga a wide berth. And why I'm so nitpicky about any work of fiction where relationships are the central focus.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

It's a frequent criticism, isn't it? and it always feel like it's missing the point.

I wouldn't go as far as say the same in real life, though >_>;;

[a-white-rain.livejournal.com]

The second:

Dude. Why the fuck would I care what anyone else ships? It's a personal thing. It's not even about my understanding it - it's just like a MYOB kinda thing. And like... who cares? It's just shipping.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

Eww Aragorn/Legolas? Teddy had a bad, bad education!

[tiamatschild.livejournal.com]

Oh yes! I mean, it's not a consistent pattern or anything, since my shipping patterns are very catholic, but right now I'm utterly adoring the Scar/Marcoh subtext (blatant subtext) the Fullmetal Alchemist manga is delivering. It's horribly wrong on multiple levels and I'm not sure how to actually tackle it, but it's fantastic. I love it.

[purple-chalk.livejournal.com]

No one around to tell him any better, and it's not exactly something he'd bring up with Hermione, who's probably the only one in that extended family unit to've read the books...

[cygna-hime.livejournal.com]

I think one of the things that's turned me off trainwreck-ships is that the ones I've seen that I, as a viewer/reader/audience of canon, think would be horribly unhealthy yet strangely attractive for all concerned seem to have this cloud of--let's call them "fanbrats"--floating around proclaiming the TRUTH and PURITY of their LOVE. And then I go, "WTF? No!" and leave for fluffier waters.

[tiamatschild.livejournal.com]

Not. Not genetically related. Which they're not. Not that it makes it much better.

[redcandle17.livejournal.com]

It's a frequent criticism, isn't it? and it always feel like it's missing the point.

Indeed. I've also noticed that people tend to be unwilling to apply the "unhealthy" label to their own preferred pairings and quick to apply it to the pairings they dislike.

I wouldn't go as far as say the same in real life, though

You know better people than me. :P

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

yes, yes, yes, me too to everything you said :D

Love as conflict is one of my biggest narrative drive, in what I like to read and what I like to write (when I was writing, that is), whether it's done in the bickering comedy style or the dark melodramatic one. The role and negotiation for power is another of the thing I love to explore.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

well I know few people in couples XDD

[schemingreader.livejournal.com]

Why would it be a problem to ship an unhealthy pairing? The characters are fictional. Any pairing with Snape in it has to be unhealthy. If the characters have matching neuroses, they can be unhealthy and happy.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

Not even Andromeda?

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

Best in both world! XD

As I said, it's because I saw several people criticising a ship (in this case Jayne/River from Firefly) on account that it couldn't be healthy and good for her.

[purple-chalk.livejournal.com]

Well, I know I sure don't share my slash preferences with my grandma, but now that you mention it she probably has read it, at least.