I've found the solution to the "cunt" conundrum!

[salinea]

So I often see people complaining of the lack of proper words for the female genitalia while writing porn, and there was that post wondering whether one should forbid the use of the word 'cunt'.

I have a solution :

You only need to stop using the word "cock" in male porn. From now on, only ever use words like "Prick" and "Dick" which can also used as an insult, just like "Cunt". That way, and there will be the same problem for everyone and both gender can be equal.

(okay, why does the fact "Ass/Arse" is also an insult has never stopped anyone from using it in fics?)

Oh, and random question of a non native English speaker : Why is "sex" never used to describe genitalia in porn (when fitting) in English? Is that a word you just never use to describe genitialias? Is it because it's too vague and not gender-specific?

Comments

[schemingreader.livejournal.com]

Some writers use "his sex" or "her sex", but it's old-fashioned, I think. Or so it sounds to my ear.

Though I might start using it because--it really sounds so nice! Formal!

I have been using "cunt" ever since I read the feminist manifesto by that name.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

old fashioned, okay, that makes sense. I like it myself, it sounds simple and straight forward without being too medical like "penis" or "vagina" by my ear is off given that I'm not a native speaker.

I know ^^ I need to find that manifesto sometimes.

I don't think there's any equivalent of "cunt" in French, its sad. Well, maybe "con" but it's really, really more often meant as the all-useful insult than for genitalia.

[the-corbie.livejournal.com]

'Cock' is used as an insult in English too. In fact I have trouble thinking of a word for any sexual organ or act that isn't...

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

I'm glad to learn that. The complain has always puzzled me when hearig it, but, being a non speaker, it's not like I could judge, not being a native speaker.

It's mostly the same in French, words are either medical, childish or vulgar.

[catiechu.livejournal.com]

Cock is generally used alongside other words when the speaker wishes to insult. Examples:

cockfag
cocksucker
cocklick
cockface
cockass

I've never heard it used exclusively by itself for the purpose of insult.

[the-corbie.livejournal.com]

On the other hand, I've never heard 'cockfag', 'cockass' or 'cocklick' used either. I hear 'you cock!' all the time.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

cockass is a very coquasse word XD

Interesting to see so many varients.

[fresne.livejournal.com]

As I recall, the general rule for words for genitalia: if it has an Anglo Saxon root then it's vulgar, if Latin it's clinical, and if it has a foreign base (mongrel language and all that) then rarely vulgar.

With a further slice that in America, words used as swear words in England, but not in the America come off as quaint rather than swearing. E.g., Bollocks, Fanny, Wanker, etc. And I would imagine it work the same way in reverse.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

that's interesting, thank you :)

What are the foreign words? Things like 'cojones' or more integrated into the English language?

I remember the whole taking adventage of Brittish swear words in Buffy. BTW I'd never seen "Fanny" before, is that a word for female genitalia?

I'm not sure it would necessarly work in reverse, we need to ask a Brittish person!

[colonel-sho.livejournal.com]

Token British person here!

I was going to answer your question but people before me have said pretty much what I was going to.

'Fanny' in Brittish English means vagina. Though, I can't honestly say I've heard it in the last 10-15 years ^.^' unless children still use it. In American English 'fanny' is ones arse. Which is why to Brittish English ears the song lyrics from Sabrina the Teenage Witch: 'shake your whammy fanny, funky song, funky song' are met with forgotten childish blushes and gleeful giggles.

'Fairy' is childish Brittish English for vagina as a random fact to add. ^.^

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

Hey, Sho! Long time not seen!

lol, fanny doesn't sound like a word very useful for porn writing then.

I though Fairy meant "queer"! Interesting ^^

[kethlenda.livejournal.com]

Fairy *is* queer in the U.S. I'd never heard of it being a vagina either, but I think that's kind of cool, in an odd way. :)

[busaikko]

* jumps in *

Here in Japan we used to have a brand of toilet paper called My Fanny. My British friends sent it home as gifts....

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

*cracks up*

[colonel-sho.livejournal.com]

Lawlz. That's awesome.

[the-corbie.livejournal.com]

This quote should answer your question:

I would fuck Bruce Willis if I had a fanny.
And I'd fuck Han Solo too, but we both know that I cannae.
The fact is I've got a cock, so the best thing I could do
Is forget actors and rock stars and concentrate on fucking you. - 'Bruce Willis', by Arab Strap.

I love that song. :p

As for whether it works the other way around, most American swearwords are pretty commonly used in the UK too. The few exceptions don't sound quaint exactly: just odd.

Oh, and it's my experience that Americans have a far lower standard of what counts as swearing, combined with the fact that they swear a lot less than us anyway. As a result most of their swearing sounds pretty tame to a Brit. :p

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

hahaha, that sounds like a fun song.

Thanks for the confirmation about American swearwords to the Brittish ear.

Well, of course, they're Americans. They'r puritains and stuff and not as fashionably decadent as us Eurocommies :p

[the-corbie.livejournal.com]

These Americans are crazy. It is known. *firm nod*

[ann1962]

There is the novel Fanny Hill. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fanny_Hill

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

That sounds like an interesting novel. Would be fun if that was the source of the word.

[fresne.livejournal.com]

Well, looks like Fanny was covered, but to recapitulate fanny can be a word for female genitalia. Or in the US little old ladies can use it to refer to the butt (at least my grandmother did). And it can be a form of the name Frances. It's one of of those funny contextually vulgar words. Although the really funny one was Anthony Trollope's mother, Frances Trollope or Fanny Trollope.

As to foreign words, cojones is a good example. I'm trying to recall some other examples. Unfortunately, the Literature class where we discussed swear words was a very long time ago.

And as stated below, Americans do have a very lower threshold of what's considered inappropriate. For example, the room where the toilets are is called a bathroom (even when there is no bath there) or a restroom (even when you don't go there to rest), and very rarely the toilet (generally being a gas station or a low class establishment).

[twhitesakura.livejournal.com]

It might have to do with sex having multiple meanings. Usually, sex means the act itself. And it can also be used as "gender." for example, on forms when you have to check either male or female (What sex are you?). If we're talking genitalia, you could say sexual organ, but that wording is more "scientific" and would kill the mood. Then there's slang uses like "sex it up" meaning, make it more sexy.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

I don't know. In french "sexe" is also very polysemic (it's the only word for "gender", it's about the activity as well etc.) but it still could be used to refer to the organs, so... ^^

Okay we don't have sex it up XD (that's one of thing I like English for <3)

[agent420.livejournal.com]

"Cunt" is my favourite word in the history of ever. ;__;

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

it's a perfectly perfect word as many words go ^^

[kethlenda.livejournal.com]

I think there's a perception that "her sex" or "his sex" is sort of archaic, old-fashioned. I kind of like it, at least in novels, but I haven't really seen it in fic.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

Yeah I like it too. I'm glad the formula exists in English even if it's rarely used. Means I could use it in fics ^^

[busaikko]

Totally off-topic, but:

If you and I ever form a band, I vote for us to be called 'The Cunt Conundrum'.

[etrangere.livejournal.com]

It would make a cool name. Now I only need to learn how to make music XD

[busaikko]

Oh, yes, well... singing, playing guitar, writing songs... we'll figure something out!