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salineaI miss old boards and forums. I miss newsnet. It's not that livejournal is a bad medium, it's an amazingly powerful, versatile a tool, that allows you to customize so many things. You don't have to bear with the clunkiness of Ezboard or the unbearable slowness of Voy. You don't even get popups, but you get lots of place for graphics, even without paying. It's incredibly rich in possibilities.
But I still miss all the other kind of boards. I miss being able to relate to a specific space where there were specific rules, a specific usual crowd, some specific moderators, and, above all that, a specific topic of interest that brought all of us together. I miss the context.
LJ is context-less. No matter where from your friends are, no matter how you relate to them (are you reading them because their close to you, because you like their fics, for the purpose of fandom, because you like their political commentary, etc. ?) they appear the same on your friend page. You can filter them (though i'm too lazy to do that) but you can't fix the fact that the paradigm of your interactions isn't structured at all. And you never quite now at what distance the people you're talking to are.
I also miss the treshold aspect of it. You get in a forum, you get in discussions with everyone, and everyone can see your post. You can answer to anyone without wondering whether they'll fill you're intruding into a private space, and even if you're totally unknown, there's a good chance you will be answered if what you say is relevant and interesting. You participate in group interactions. Along the way, you get to know people, and from conversations to conversation, you get to consider them as friends, merely interesting partners in debate, or people you don't especially like but that are part of the collective background.
With LJ, you have absolutly no clue what does it mean to friend someone. Usually if you meet someone on LJ, you find them interesting and you want to get to know them better because you wonder if maybe you could become friends.... well you friend them. Which brings you at once to the most private and intimate possible way to interact with them, and in an "official" way. (Of course, again, you can use filters to keep a gradation of how close you are to people... provided you're willing to go into friend only, which I am not) If you find out eventually that any interesting person isn't for any reasons likely to become your friend, you can only "break up" with them by unfriending them. So very awkward.
Of course, people have tried to address that in many ways. They call "friend list" "reading list"; and they use several journals for several kinds of interaction (one private journal, one fandom journal etc.) However, once more, I'm too lazy to do that (and I find logging in and logging out much too annoying too)
Fact remains that LJ remains a very twisted mix of private and public and semi public interactions. On one hand, it's a place which is your journal, YOURS to tell about your life or anything that strikes your fancy. On the other hand, you are published on the friend list of anyone who wants to read you and that you don't specificaly filter, and they might call on you for bad formatting, flaming things they like and general wank.
Not to mention that LJ are so cliquish in its very nature that you don't even notice that it's cliquish because the wild troll flaming the place doesn't even exist in your eyes unless they start flaming your own journal. Sometimes it's a good thing, because it diminishes abrasive arguments. Sometimes it's a bad things, because you don't even see the possibly legitimate criticisms addressed to a fandom. We all live in our own little world, and we never see what we don't want to see.
Now, of course, one of the value of Internet lies in its anonymousity. You can take much more liberty with revealing personnal and private things to people, because you're dealing with strangers and are likely to remain so. That makes you more free of revealing different aspects of yourself. You're not doomed to a specific identity because everyone knows you already as such. Different place, differenty space, different situations, different attitudes. Different personna (personnae ?). Why, yes, that's interactionnism.
And that's exactly the place where LJ is failing. With previous media, my attitude changed. I didn't act the same way in ATPoBtVS (mixt crowd, rather older than I, very cultured); as I did on roleplaying game Exalted forums (big male majority, about the same age as I) or as I do in the Clamp fandom (big female majority, younger than I, different lingos)
That doesn't mean that I'm lying in any of those fandoms, only that I adapted my behaviour to the context and the situation of each forum for a maximum enjoyment of the interactions.
No such possibility with LJ. Entries that are serious and reflexive in tone sit next to the ones where I'm making rant or laughing silly about a private joke. Parts of my flist (as an audience) will always miss part of the context of everything I will say. And many times I'm afraid i'm going to bore them to tears / freak them out / disapoint them because of it.
And likewise, I have nothing to say in answer to part of what people on my flist (as performers) are saying.
Which leads me to the third part of my rant, reciprocity. In away, recriprocity is made an even bigger part of relationships between people on the internet. In fandom, your status is directly relevant to how much you contribute to the fandom, be it in the form of discussions, admnistration, essays, fanfics, graphics, programs, ressources and of course, reviews. (I'm not going to mention the clientelist relationship between a BFN and their worshippers :p)
By making comments so much easier and simpler to give, LJ welcomes much more direct interaction. And indeed, the duty of readers to provide feedback to a writer they like has become almost seen as a civil duty (at least in ideal, obviously in fact many many people don't bother), and lurking has become a habit looked down upon. (Or at least it seems to me that such a shift has occured, but it could be only because I moved to different fandoms that worked in a different way) That's globally a good thing. But it does have some less nice consequences. I have not waited to be on LJ to start posting because I wanted people to answer what I said. However what gets me the most comments on LJ is unfailingly the post to which I wanted the least. Such as personnal entries where i talk about problems in my life and general moodiness, or memes where I offer to say things to the people answering the comment. In a way, it's sweet : one case shows that people care for me (despite the fact that I hate when people worry for me and that I'm generally very uncomfortable with dealing with people as person and not around some random kind of abstract subject); and the other is one of the perks of LJ : you give people things by answering memes, and they give you the same in exchange. That's how you form bonds isn't it. However, it leaves me craving for other kind of interactions, more topic centered or abstract, the ones that are less emotionnaly based (regardless of the fact I adore people from my flist) and I don't really know how to find them on LJ (and participate to them).
But there's people on my flist, actually, lots of them, which I read because I'm interested in what they post (be it commentary, recs, essays, fics or random quotes) and not at all in them as a person, and I usually do without warning them. How can those people know what i want when I friend them ? What does it mean what they reciprocate (still as wordlessly). What kind of relationship is it that we have ? I'm not either against eventually considering them as friends, however lots of people did that with me, and we still have the same lack of interaction.
In a different fashion, I have lots of people on my flist which I have friended because we were close pals in fandom a long time ago. However, as iour nterests diverged, I hardly ever finds anything interesting in their entries, but I still care for them as a person. However, I have nothing to say to them, they have nothing to say to me.... and at some point i'm getting sad/angry at the whole situation because in the absence of mutual commenting there is no more relationship, and I start to wonder why they keep me on their flist, and why I keep them in mine, no matter the fact that they're people I genuinely like.
Of course, LJ has got Communities which are closer to classical forms of boards. However due to the linnear nature of LJ, I've seldom seen the kind of collective atmosphere on any LJ similar to that of any forum. Posts get burried under other posts pretty quickly and seldom get digged back. They don't get back up like a threads where a new answer has just been posted. And more often than not the interaction between the poster and a serie of people who answer them, and seldom between groups of people all participating to one discussion. (Indeed, when two commentors start discussing between each other in answer to another post, they will often appologize and start a new post somewhere else to continue it if they're polite)
So, those are most of the things bothering me with Live journal. That's why I'm missing the old boards, even though LJ spoils us with some many good tools and possibilities that i might never bear going back to their clunkiness.
But I still miss all the other kind of boards. I miss being able to relate to a specific space where there were specific rules, a specific usual crowd, some specific moderators, and, above all that, a specific topic of interest that brought all of us together. I miss the context.
LJ is context-less. No matter where from your friends are, no matter how you relate to them (are you reading them because their close to you, because you like their fics, for the purpose of fandom, because you like their political commentary, etc. ?) they appear the same on your friend page. You can filter them (though i'm too lazy to do that) but you can't fix the fact that the paradigm of your interactions isn't structured at all. And you never quite now at what distance the people you're talking to are.
I also miss the treshold aspect of it. You get in a forum, you get in discussions with everyone, and everyone can see your post. You can answer to anyone without wondering whether they'll fill you're intruding into a private space, and even if you're totally unknown, there's a good chance you will be answered if what you say is relevant and interesting. You participate in group interactions. Along the way, you get to know people, and from conversations to conversation, you get to consider them as friends, merely interesting partners in debate, or people you don't especially like but that are part of the collective background.
With LJ, you have absolutly no clue what does it mean to friend someone. Usually if you meet someone on LJ, you find them interesting and you want to get to know them better because you wonder if maybe you could become friends.... well you friend them. Which brings you at once to the most private and intimate possible way to interact with them, and in an "official" way. (Of course, again, you can use filters to keep a gradation of how close you are to people... provided you're willing to go into friend only, which I am not) If you find out eventually that any interesting person isn't for any reasons likely to become your friend, you can only "break up" with them by unfriending them. So very awkward.
Of course, people have tried to address that in many ways. They call "friend list" "reading list"; and they use several journals for several kinds of interaction (one private journal, one fandom journal etc.) However, once more, I'm too lazy to do that (and I find logging in and logging out much too annoying too)
Fact remains that LJ remains a very twisted mix of private and public and semi public interactions. On one hand, it's a place which is your journal, YOURS to tell about your life or anything that strikes your fancy. On the other hand, you are published on the friend list of anyone who wants to read you and that you don't specificaly filter, and they might call on you for bad formatting, flaming things they like and general wank.
Not to mention that LJ are so cliquish in its very nature that you don't even notice that it's cliquish because the wild troll flaming the place doesn't even exist in your eyes unless they start flaming your own journal. Sometimes it's a good thing, because it diminishes abrasive arguments. Sometimes it's a bad things, because you don't even see the possibly legitimate criticisms addressed to a fandom. We all live in our own little world, and we never see what we don't want to see.
Now, of course, one of the value of Internet lies in its anonymousity. You can take much more liberty with revealing personnal and private things to people, because you're dealing with strangers and are likely to remain so. That makes you more free of revealing different aspects of yourself. You're not doomed to a specific identity because everyone knows you already as such. Different place, differenty space, different situations, different attitudes. Different personna (personnae ?). Why, yes, that's interactionnism.
And that's exactly the place where LJ is failing. With previous media, my attitude changed. I didn't act the same way in ATPoBtVS (mixt crowd, rather older than I, very cultured); as I did on roleplaying game Exalted forums (big male majority, about the same age as I) or as I do in the Clamp fandom (big female majority, younger than I, different lingos)
That doesn't mean that I'm lying in any of those fandoms, only that I adapted my behaviour to the context and the situation of each forum for a maximum enjoyment of the interactions.
No such possibility with LJ. Entries that are serious and reflexive in tone sit next to the ones where I'm making rant or laughing silly about a private joke. Parts of my flist (as an audience) will always miss part of the context of everything I will say. And many times I'm afraid i'm going to bore them to tears / freak them out / disapoint them because of it.
And likewise, I have nothing to say in answer to part of what people on my flist (as performers) are saying.
Which leads me to the third part of my rant, reciprocity. In away, recriprocity is made an even bigger part of relationships between people on the internet. In fandom, your status is directly relevant to how much you contribute to the fandom, be it in the form of discussions, admnistration, essays, fanfics, graphics, programs, ressources and of course, reviews. (I'm not going to mention the clientelist relationship between a BFN and their worshippers :p)
By making comments so much easier and simpler to give, LJ welcomes much more direct interaction. And indeed, the duty of readers to provide feedback to a writer they like has become almost seen as a civil duty (at least in ideal, obviously in fact many many people don't bother), and lurking has become a habit looked down upon. (Or at least it seems to me that such a shift has occured, but it could be only because I moved to different fandoms that worked in a different way) That's globally a good thing. But it does have some less nice consequences. I have not waited to be on LJ to start posting because I wanted people to answer what I said. However what gets me the most comments on LJ is unfailingly the post to which I wanted the least. Such as personnal entries where i talk about problems in my life and general moodiness, or memes where I offer to say things to the people answering the comment. In a way, it's sweet : one case shows that people care for me (despite the fact that I hate when people worry for me and that I'm generally very uncomfortable with dealing with people as person and not around some random kind of abstract subject); and the other is one of the perks of LJ : you give people things by answering memes, and they give you the same in exchange. That's how you form bonds isn't it. However, it leaves me craving for other kind of interactions, more topic centered or abstract, the ones that are less emotionnaly based (regardless of the fact I adore people from my flist) and I don't really know how to find them on LJ (and participate to them).
But there's people on my flist, actually, lots of them, which I read because I'm interested in what they post (be it commentary, recs, essays, fics or random quotes) and not at all in them as a person, and I usually do without warning them. How can those people know what i want when I friend them ? What does it mean what they reciprocate (still as wordlessly). What kind of relationship is it that we have ? I'm not either against eventually considering them as friends, however lots of people did that with me, and we still have the same lack of interaction.
In a different fashion, I have lots of people on my flist which I have friended because we were close pals in fandom a long time ago. However, as iour nterests diverged, I hardly ever finds anything interesting in their entries, but I still care for them as a person. However, I have nothing to say to them, they have nothing to say to me.... and at some point i'm getting sad/angry at the whole situation because in the absence of mutual commenting there is no more relationship, and I start to wonder why they keep me on their flist, and why I keep them in mine, no matter the fact that they're people I genuinely like.
Of course, LJ has got Communities which are closer to classical forms of boards. However due to the linnear nature of LJ, I've seldom seen the kind of collective atmosphere on any LJ similar to that of any forum. Posts get burried under other posts pretty quickly and seldom get digged back. They don't get back up like a threads where a new answer has just been posted. And more often than not the interaction between the poster and a serie of people who answer them, and seldom between groups of people all participating to one discussion. (Indeed, when two commentors start discussing between each other in answer to another post, they will often appologize and start a new post somewhere else to continue it if they're polite)
So, those are most of the things bothering me with Live journal. That's why I'm missing the old boards, even though LJ spoils us with some many good tools and possibilities that i might never bear going back to their clunkiness.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 06:54 pm (UTC)Quite a few people on my friends list are only there because I like their fanfiction or for fandom reasons. However, many of them have been turned into real friends by reading their personal journals, which makes me feel closer to them while it lets me in on their real life.
The other half of my friends list would be people that I have friended (or vice versa) because of similar interests. I may have talked to them on communities before, and we hit it off well... or I may have looked at their LJ interests and found out we had many things in common. Thus, a friending. (I know I'm not making a point, I'm just rambling.)
Now, about this line: However, as our interests diverged, I hardly ever find anything interesting in their entries, but I still care for them as a person.
YES, YES, and YES. A lot of my livejournal friends are from when I was die-hard into X/1999 and various CLAMP series, but as my fandom changed to Fullmetal Alchemist, I lost touch with a few of them. But, I still care about the person no matter what. However, the lack of commenting gets me scared, and I feel like I should take them off my friends list... but I don't want to, because I like the person. It's weird. And confusing.
And... sometimes, I feel like I have to make my posts suitable for an audience, but then again... I never really do that. I always post about my day, and if I'm angry, oh man, you're going to get a nice post about that. However, I feel like I'm flooding my friends list with unnecessary things that they don't care about. Now that right there is just... ugh. It's your journal, so you can write anything in it, but the fact that our idea of journal is now memes, fandom related posts, and getting the most comments really makes me a bit discouraged. :/
...I think I have more to say, but I can't remember what. XD I'll be back later, don't worry.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:20 pm (UTC)I agree with, with some of my friends, it gives me an opportunity to be closer to them and to get to know them intimately. But in all the cases when it doesn't work like that, it can be... awkward.
I did start out seeing LJ as a mean to keep contact with friends from a fandom I wasn't anymore. However if I look at the state of my current relationship with those friends, the situation isn't very bright :(
It's your journal, so you can write anything in it, but the fact that our idea of journal is now memes, fandom related posts, and getting the most comments really makes me a bit discouraged. :/
Yeah, it's complex because it's both at the same time. A journal IS your journal, where you should legitimately be allowed to post whatever you feel like. But it's also a mean of interacting with a fandom, which means behaving according to rules of politeness and unspoken code so as to fit with the group. And it can also be a place to publish and journalize for an audience, where people friend you because they're interested in the content of your entries (fics, political blogs, etc.)
It's all of that at the same time. Mixed. And unless you just make several journals, or decide to filter and thus get friend only, you have no way to say when which is which and read adequatly.
*hugs* thanks for answering ^^
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:49 pm (UTC)True. I know that a lot of people that enjoy memes and fandom posts (such as myself,) but I also know a few who feel like they can't post anything about their feelings or real life because they are afraid that the "audience" (aka friends list) will dislike it. I can name a number of times when I have seen friends who use LJ cuts for posts about real life, because they believe that posting that sort of thing is "spam." XD And it's not. But then again, what can I do? ::shrug::
But I do agree - it's all mixed and complicated. :D I'm just saying that some people feel like it is mandatory to only post things that the people on their friends list will enjoy. However, hey, if that's what they want to do, power to them.
:D Woo, I like discussions like these.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:21 pm (UTC)(I for one am very annoyed by people who post image heavy memes without lj-cutting them)
Different people friends for different reasons and have the potential to annoyed for different reasons. And you have no way from knowing why unless they start to tell you. And on your own flist, they probably want different things.
Then of course, there's the "my journal, my rules" and "I never made you friend me" attitude. Which I think is very healthy (that is until someone post a fucking annoying meme that stretched my flist into unreadability, at which point I'll start to rant about basic civility ^^)
And really, I don't know. Part of me wants to use LJ to talk about my life, about my thoughts, in a very honnest way.
Another part wants to use it for fandom, because I love fandom, I love interacting with fandom, and using LJ to get into fandom is rich with potential !
But then it makes using it as the first thing a bit awkward... >_>
(I love those kind of discussions too ! *glomps*)
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:03 pm (UTC)I apologize for being kind of off in the chat last night, too...I was kind of getting upset at the other participant because she was spreading wank without really knowing what she was talking about, and was trying to come up with a "conspiracy theory" or something. I mean, I hate to be judgemental, but if people are going to get that batshit over a fake cup that they have to cheat, let them, because their lives are obviously devoid of meaning anyway. That said, I seriously DO NOT think that Noah favors the Slytherins and everyone is just being overly dramatic about it. I'm sorry, I don't mean to rant, I was really irritated last night about it, and I probably should have said something then. I just don't think I could have phrased it in a "nice" way. I was also chatting in two chats, plus an extra person. Eep! So again, I apologize.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:43 pm (UTC)There's some people who I comment sometimes on even though we're not close because I just find what they say interesting and I want to answer, to discuss... but I'm never quite sure how they're taking it. There's some people with which I never dare to even do that.
I totally understand your attitude in the chat. I'm still new to the comm and hardly know what rumours might be true or not, but the whole idea of being willing to cheat for such a purely fictionnal aim as the House cup makes me laugh as well. It's sad, really. And I'm very annoyed by the "they cheat, so let us cheat as well, it's only fair" attitude.
I do love for us to be mobilized and enthousiastic with fighting for the cup. It's fun, it increases participation and thus quality of entries, and it helps bonding. But if it's to be done in any thing than a spirit of good fun and the idea that competition helps us giving the best of ourselves, it's simply not worth it.
So I understand why you felt irritated. In any case you hardly need to appologize for not being very present in chats (God knows I'm doing that as well)
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:50 pm (UTC)I just felt somewhat guilty, but I was fuming. That is the worst spirit of competition, and we need to focus on what is at hand, instead of dredging ourselves down in old gossip and accusations. If we want to win, we need to stop being asshats and freaking participate (myself included). That's it in a nutshell. :P
LOL, I usually stay away from Gryff chats as well, becuase it makes my brain hurt. Gryffs are all attention whores, so you get like 5 of them in a room and all Hell breaks loose. I can't keep up. XD
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:25 pm (UTC)Amen to that.
*chuckles* There is that, and lots of sexual conversations too. It's not uninteresting.
I like to quietly observe and make notes, from times to times, it's the Ravenclaw in me ;)
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:48 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:29 pm (UTC)LJ is nice in that it's not something that goes down easily, and it's easy to keep track of people with it. You can use it keep track of people you meet at cons, making swapping contact info as easy as writing out your journal name. It's also good for keeping track of fanfiction and various fandoms...and a multitude of other things, but because it's all in one place, it becomes a confusing jumble that is difficult to sort out. I also miss the community discussion aspect of more traditional boards...
And it's a bit socially awkward as well...but overall, it's still nice in some ways, even if it's easy to get lost in because there's so many things to do and read.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:53 pm (UTC)LJ has got a lot of qualities, I agree with you. Those last monthes I've been using it a lot for searching good fics, keeping track of fics and interacting with people through comments. However, i've also been posting very few things and glancing over many of my friends' entries. I makes me wonder about the way we use LJ in general. I don't know, maybe i just haven't figured the hang of it yet XD
Thank you for commenting ! ♥
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:44 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:04 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:21 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 07:50 pm (UTC)While I don't think about all of this while I post in my own LJ, I do notice the awkwardness in large communities or if I want to comment in a post by someone who isn't on my flist. Eh, I don't know what can I say that you haven't said already...
However, I like that things are so... "mixed up", so to say, in LJ. Everybody uses it differently, and you are constantly adapting. It's interesting.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:07 pm (UTC)And it is interesting ! It's so huge, and rich, and varied, I love that ! I'm not wanting to criticize LJ as being all bad and unproper to use. I'm just trying to pin down why I feel sometimes so uneasy using it as it's been increasingly frustrating me.
Thanks for commenting ^^
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:20 pm (UTC)Oh, don't worry, I didn't interpret it that way. :) I just meant to say that I'm the kind of person who prefers the LJ-way than the boards-way, even if I post in both.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:22 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:31 pm (UTC)For CLAMP, I post at Kiri's board, that's still tiny.
And I sometimes post at za href="http://www.godawful.net/forums/">GAFF, though I'm usually lurking there. That one is huge and, by nature, can be quite nasty. I've noticed that the only people I recognize by username there are the really loud and mean ones.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:43 pm (UTC)whoaw, I hadn't even realized that Kiri had a board #-_-;#
no subject
Date: 7 July 2005 02:45 pm (UTC)I just administrate/moderate it ^^U
...okay, so it's sort of mine, yeah.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:26 pm (UTC)It's just so weird when you see people do the "is it ok to friend you?" dance. It's more than a little sad that we have to ask permission to be somebody's friend. I understand the feeling of discomfort when being tagged by a serial adder--but usually that's not the case.
Weird that the biggest act of bravery tends to be talking to somebody in their own journal.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 08:45 pm (UTC)Bravery is something sorely needed in many parts of one's life.
no subject
Date: 6 July 2005 11:36 pm (UTC)I suppose being territorial helps me escape any feelings of obligation towards my f-list, beyond the basic courtesy of lj-cutting memes and hugely long entries. My journal, my posts, mixed up between RL and various fandoms and just general rambling. And as much as I admit to considering "Is this LJ post annoying?" or "Will anyone care about this?" the notion of censorship in my own space irks me so much that I have a hard time quite understanding why other people would worry about such a thing, or feel obligated to perform. I am stubborn and more inclined to just say whatever the hell I want after hearing about how someone feels that he or she can't speak anymore--maybe to prove that they're wrong if only they can cast off what's holding them back, I dunno. But my method of resisting any so-called "need" for conformity won't work for most people, I guess. *G*
I know what you mean about people you are personally interested in even though you've gone in separate fandom directions. I know many people like that, and sometimes I am concerned about losing contact, but I find if the friendship is concrete enough, than everything will work out in the end unless there is some gross neglect on either (or both) sides. I'm pretty good at finding kindred spirits and if the connection fades... then it just wasn't meant to be. Which isn't to say I abandon people as soon as we no longer gush about Subaru or whatever. ^^;
I dunno, I just have the impression that if people friend my journal, they enjoy reading most of the content if not all of it, which means they like reading what I, not a persona, write. After all, if they only like my fanfiction, that's what my ficlog is for. If they only like my icons, that's what my icon LJ is for. There are the occasional weirdoes who crop up with "I love your icons SO MUCH LET'S BE FRIENDS" but they're few and far between. Or I'm just living in my own little bubble that hasn't yet burst.
I know it's not always a case of taking LJ too seriously, but a lot of the time it seems like that to me. When it gets to the point where you're writing posts only for other people rather than yourself (regardless of whether or not you wrote a post designed to be replied to, if you wanted to write it it's still your post), it's either time to drop LJ or rebel against your perceived restrictions. Guess what I do! *G*
(I enjoy rambly sentences, let us hope they make sense.)
no subject
Date: 13 July 2005 06:01 pm (UTC)I'm pretty good at finding kindred spirits and if the connection fades... then it just wasn't meant to be. Which isn't to say I abandon people as soon as we no longer gush about Subaru or whatever. ^^;
I'm glad to hear that XD
After all, if they only like my fanfiction, that's what my ficlog is for. If they only like my icons, that's what my icon LJ is for.
Yes, that's a good point.
But then that's why BNF worship is so disturbing.
Thanks for your comment, that was very enjoyable to read ^^
no subject
Date: 7 July 2005 12:52 am (UTC)LJ is awkward. I rarely ask people to friend me, as I'm too shy about it. I think I've only done it twice. I don't really know how do I friend back or what logic do I follow. I have 49 'friends', and I'm 'friend of' 76. Honestly, I dislike friending a total stranger or someone who only shares one or two interests, just because he/she stalks me and it's supposed to be "fair". I used to friend almost everyone back a long time ago, but now I just do it only if I know them from somewhere else, I find their posts interesting or any other special circunstances. Also, if they stalk me for months and they never comment in my blog, chances are I'm not wasting my time with them, especially if I find their journal too personal and full of RL references I don't get at all.
About talking about RL... well, at the beginning this was going to be a fandom journal, after all. I had my own blog and I used to use it for personal posts, while the LJ was for long rants that I'd feel bad putting in my blog as they're too long and LJ has the nifty cut option. That's why my journal is not so personal. Seldomly, posts are personal, and only when I'm too stressed or depressed. I remember, last December, I used to talk about the stuff I bought or was planning to buy, and nobody ever commented. Then I noticed my audience doesn't care a lot about my own life, they just keep coming for fandom and randomness.
Then there was a time I felt pressured to post personal things on my blog, and I didn't want to and postponed it every time. I don't like to talk about my personal life anymore. It's depressive, as I'm a boring person and I have a lot of issues, and more than relieving my feelings it could turned out as "hey, people care about my whining; I sound like a melodrama" OR "hey, people don't care about my whining; they don't love me at all!!". That's why my whines tend to be either f-locked or private. Somehow, I don't want to know who cares about my problems, as it can lead to know who doesn't. And it might break my heart if an important friend won't post in a personal entry, while they will in a fandom entry the next day.
There's the fact I don't want to read about everyday, monotone events in my flist. I'm not going to be a hypocrit. Half of them are quite boring, while the other half I never know what to comment without feeling awkward with the OP. I mean, if they talk about extraordinary events; it's okay, it's good, I like that. But if they turn their journal into a log for what unknown classmate #4 did during this class, or the non-sensical AIM chat with this LJ friend only them both care about, or your dinner conversation with your parent that night... no, okay. No. I'll probably skip their entry and, if they go on, I'll get so used to it I'll skip all their entries forever. I don't want to read your "dear diary" sort of thing, I'm not your high school bestest friend.
I'm just not comfortable with that level of confidence with someone who read two or three of my communities and never comment in my posts as they're not about their main fandoms. Why do I have to know everything about their frigging life, when they know squat about mine? It's exhausting to keep up. Why are we still mutual friends, anyway? We just don't fucking care.
I know I'm not making any sense, but that's how I feel. I come to the internet to forget about reality, not to sulk even more into it. That's why I focus myself in fandom activities instead. It's supposed to be for fun, right? And it's not exactly fun for me if I have to tell my flist I had a fight with this family member because they think I'm subnormal, it's really cold outside and my molar hurts.
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Date: 13 July 2005 06:16 pm (UTC)You know that's what I should do. Getting back into board. I still recieve many mailinglist but I so not read them ^^.
LJ is awkward. I rarely ask people to friend me, as I'm too shy about it.
Yeah, I remember when I harassed you into joining the shrine and then friended you. God, I'm shameless... >_>
but now I just do it only if I know them from somewhere else, I find their posts interesting or any other special circunstances. Also, if they stalk me for months and they never comment in my blog, chances are I'm not wasting my time with them, especially if I find their journal too personal and full of RL references I don't get at all.
Sounds about a much better way to handle things.
I definitly don't think anyone is supposed to friend back someone just because they friended them first. Especially in cases of sneak-friends.
I friend people too easily. I act like that in life too, and it's always caused be problems. I always had a hard time making deeper ties with people. I have true friends now, but I didn't use to until I was maybe 17 or 18.
Then I noticed my audience doesn't care a lot about my own life, they just keep coming for fandom and randomness.
Yeah sadly, it's often true...
Somehow, I don't want to know who cares about my problems, as it can lead to know who doesn't. And it might break my heart if an important friend won't post in a personal entry, while they will in a fandom entry the next day.
The dynamics of when to comment or not to a personnal post is always very difficult.
When I've posted personnal posts, I know I was sometimes disturbed, surprised and touched by wom would answer. They were often not the people I was thinking would. Sometimes I didn't really want to have people answer my posts too... (I should just learn to remove the possibility to comment but it freaks me out when other people do that so I try to avoid it)
I've answered some very personnal posts from people, telling about similar personnal experiences... and I felt hurt when they never answered me. Sometimes I don't dare posting because it's from someone I don't feel like I know them enough, or because I just don't know what to say.
People often do not know how to deal with very personnal stories, especially if they're very disturbing and sad.
I don't want to read your "dear diary" sort of thing, I'm not your high school bestest friend.
I agree. There's very few people on my flist I'd be interested for that kind of things from.
It's supposed to be for fun, right?
Lots of people forget that about fandom, I think...
*hugs* Thanks for your comment, it was very interesting (and made much sense, actually)
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Date: 7 July 2005 05:58 am (UTC)Filtering content makes it easier to separate out people on the basis of what they're interested in, but then that means the bother of being friends only, and possibly upsetting people in the course of that, so it's hardly a perfect solution.
Communities on LJ don't quite live up to content-specific message boards and things like that, I admit. It is so easy for something that could have been a fascinating discussion to get swept away amongst all the other posts. I hadn't thought about it much, but you're right, LJ doesn't have group discussions like message boards and such do, and that is a pity. That said, I like to post on LJ a lot more than I ever did when I used to hang around (translation: lurk at) message boards. It'd be nice if there was a type of community introduced that would behave more like a message board (so that topics wouldn't be so easily missed), but still be integrated with the rest of LJ.
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Date: 13 July 2005 06:31 pm (UTC)lol; yes, that's one of the thing I wonder about too.
That said, I like to post on LJ a lot more than I ever did when I used to hang around (translation: lurk at) message boards. It'd be nice if there was a type of community introduced that would behave more like a message board (so that topics wouldn't be so easily missed), but still be integrated with the rest of LJ.
Yeah, you're right, i'd like that.
Thanks for your comment ♥
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Date: 7 July 2005 08:51 pm (UTC)It´s you I am interested in, and ocasionally book and comics recs. We met in a fandom, sort of fandom, though it took me years to adjust that word to it. I just don´t get a lot of the LJ things, I am not into fanfiction ( famous last words right?), or much as I like something I do not get dragged into looking other fans of it frequently. Iconage sort of baffles me though I can admire other people´s icons. Meme´s, ahem, I am picky about those as well.
Mostly I use LJ as a sort of open letter to friends, spread a bit around the world. It´s not particularly interesting to those who do not know me, not sure I can set out to be interesting all of a sudden, or of course suceed. And of course to check on some of those friends, of whom you are a pretty important one, and one of those I can relate so easily. Sometimes you just lose that chit chat fluency, and up to a point you are feeling self conscious of instigating contact, specially when you are no longer sure you have much in common anyway.
You know a lot of my local gang ( no fandom at all) just went through a trend of ditching livejournal and installing blogs at blogspot. I whined, it was so much more convenient FOR ME everything on the same page, but I can figure out the reasoning - plus it does look better they were right ;)
Isn´t it strange and sort of expected? The strength of livejournal is making social ties easy, but we are human, those social ties are never that easy are they? Your anthropological way was right on it ;)